San Diego: When You have a Higher Calling and Need Media Attention, Reach to Publicity For Good, CEO Heather Holmes explains
Publicity for Good is a millennial run communications firm that provides high-level disruptive, publicity and social media services for wide array of purpose driven clients in the food beverage and beauty industry.
In 2016 by Heather Holmes former miss Ohio international celebrated publicist and Forbes 30 under 30 nominee publicity for good has built a reputation as the countries number one PR agency for CPG brands that have social causes built into their DNA.
Publicity For Food CEO Heather Holmes
Today’s conversation with Heather Homes from PublicityForGood.com has been edited for length and clarity. For the full, un-edited conversation, visit our YouTube channel here.
Joe Winger:
Heather Holmes from PublicityForGood.com. I’m a big fan because you’ve helped us facilitate a lot of previous conversations about food and drink and nutrition and all the things we like talking about.
What’s the most important thing that you want to share with the audience today?
Heather Holmes:
I really want to take away the unknown or worry about getting in the media. I want to make it more accessible to amazing brands and people.
So I definitely want to share tactical advice that if someone is reading this, they have a good story in business, they have the confidence that their story is good enough and they could absolutely make an impact and grow their business by getting in the media.
Joe Winger:
Starting with the basics, let’s pretend I have a company, I think I want public attention. I want to reach out to someone like you.
So what should I be thinking about? What do I present to you as a step one?
Heather Holmes:
Step one is really the intentionality of why you want to get in the media. What’s your goal? Are you wanting to reach more people? Are you wanting to get your story out there?
Are you wanting more sales and more people to buy your product?
You really need to know. Where you’re going first, and if you don’t know where you’re going, or you don’t have a vision, then it’s really hard to help you.
But if you have clarity there, then we can really pull back and help you identify your story, how you’re different, your why, and why your product and or company, would be really great to be in the media.
The PublicityForGood Team
FlavRReport.com on YouTube
Joe Winger:
Now, looking at the grand scheme of the campaign, what kind of a campaign should we be looking for: expectations, results?
Heather Holmes:
After we know our outcome that we’re wanting to get more sales, more backlinks, or name in the media, then what I like to do first is work with every entrepreneur, and even if you have a product, to really reflect in “why your story matters”
Why does your product matter?
If you’ve never been in the media before, I take people for an exercise where I have them draw on a piece of paper, them as a baby, to where they are now.
I have them write the key pivotal moments that have happened in their life that have made them start that company, because those little components are absolutely a part of your story.
I’ve been in the media 700 plus times: Inside Edition, Fox News, The New York Coast, incredible media, but it hasn’t always been about being a publicist, right?
Yes. I’m the founder of Publicity For Good, but a lot of that has been my story or building a seven figure company from an airstream.
Now I have almost two under two with a third on the way.
So you need to have your key pivotal moments because those are things you can talk about in the media.
Then we need to look at what’s going on in the news and how we bridge the gap between your product. Relevancy.
Joe Winger:
People may not know you are a former Miss Ohio International. Can you tell us a lesson you learned from being a former Miss Ohio International that you’re using in today’s work?
Heather Holmes:
It’s really all about your platform and reaching new audiences.
When I was building my company I decided I wanted to get into pageants. I wanted to meet a community of like minded people that wanted to make a difference in the world.
It was a way for me to have a platform because at the time I was talking about why you absolutely can build a profitable business. But also make a difference in your community and make a difference amongst your team. And really just build an incredible legacy.
So that was why I did the pageants.
I did a bunch of publicity and again, it made me relevant and timely because that was what got me in the media because I was Miss Ohio and I was only Miss Ohio International for a period of time.
So it gave me that relevancy. So you have to be relevant.
You have to bridge the gap between what’s happening in the news, or we often use Awareness Days, National Nutrition Month, National Social Media Day, and you have to position your product or yourself as the solution.
[For example], we were talking about an incredible juice brand, but most pitches I see are very promotional, right? It needs to be how you or your product simplifies people’s lives. How are you adding value? Or you don’t have a product you need to inspire people.
Joe Winger:
You’re growing a 7- figure business. What’s it like growing a huge business while you’re taking care of your kids and for a while you were living out of your Airstream
Heather Holmes:
We lived out of a 23 foot airstream for 3 1/2 years. I went from dating to engaged, to married to [my first child] Rose, who’s almost two, who lived in our airstream with us.
The year the pandemic [hit] was our first million dollar year.
I think a lot of the reason why it was that year is because when March hit, everyone was so scared that we lost about 40% of our business, number one.
Number two, we had to hustle and grit to make it. There was no choice of failing. All the distractions were gone.
When you’re in an Airstream, all you have is your laptop, but we had no external distractions, and then everything else was closed.
So the only focus we could do was our business and we had to scale out of necessity because we didn’t want to lose what we had put so much time in.
Fast forward, we now have 22 acres where we live and we have two under two, we have one on the way, we’re a full time team of 40, and it’s not easy.
I say transparently, it’s a hot mess. There are so many miracles that happen every day, but life is one, right? I can’t turn off my founder hat and publicist hat and then “Oh, I’m a mom”. It’s all one.
So yes, I might have Rose [my daughter] on a call with me from time to time, but I’ve learned that the more you step in and embrace your life, who you are and the realness, sometimes people opt out and that’s okay.
And this is my legacy.
I like these missions that we’re doing good work to us is way more than a business. We want to grow your brand and mission and we take it so seriously.
So it’s not perfect. It’s not perfectly scheduled. I’m a full time mom, all the time on the weekends when the kids are sleeping, we’re working.
We know where we want to go, and these clients and ambitions that we’re aligned with and supporting are helping people with their health.
Joe Winger:
What an incredible story to share.
Heather Holmes: I have so much to share. Like I was adopted when I was a week old to having two under two and another one on the way and building a business and building a homestead.
It’s so crazy. Austin, who’s my husband, the first week we were dating, we’re all about intentionality. I have the journal and we mapped everything out.
This year, we were going to get engaged then married. Austin and I,l we will have been together almost five years.
We’ve had a kid every year. Rose will be two in June.
We want to build a business. We want to impact our clients, brands, and scale their business. We want our team to get better and flourish in their personal lives too.
This is our mission and I’ve seen so many miracles happen from getting in the media on a personal level.
I was talking to [a business owner client] and her business grew by 40% from getting in the media.
One of my favorite cookie brands, a mom had an incredible heart story. She went on our local news and she brought in $12,000 worth of sales, just the local people wanting to support her.
On the flip side, when people Google my name, it’s like my social currency, there’s all these articles. So I have so much peace in that. Our kids will see the good work we’re doing.
Joe Winger:
You’re talking to an audience of foodies. What is your favorite meal?
Heather Holmes:
We just had Indian food last night that my husband made and it was so good.
We used to live in San Diego and I think San Diego has the best food. It’s all fresh. We’ve traveled a lot. We’ve been to Bali, their food is pretty incredible too. Where we live [now] we’re right outside of Asheville and Charlotte. So they have some good restaurants, but like I’m not in the phase right now where I’m the foodie like I used to be.
[At our house] we have chickens and we have fresh eggs. So I’m obsessed with fresh eggs every morning. You’re living a good life when you can go get your eggs and have them at home with some goat cheese.
And honestly, I love Livermuth. Crazy. So I’d say some Livermuth fried in a cast iron with some eggs and goat cheese. It’s the simple things that I really do love.
Joe Winger:
Heather Holmes with Publicity for Good. As we wrap up, whether it’s a potential client, a potential vendor, someone wanting your help with publicity, what are the best ways to find, follow you, websites, social media, etc?
Heather Holmes:
You can go to PublicityForGood.com You can find me on social media as well.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/heatherdesantis
https://www.instagram.com/heatherdesantis
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Bark and Barware enters the cocktail market with their premium cocktail smoker, including 6 flavors.
Bark and Barware’s Harel Levy
Today, Bark and Barware’s Harel Levy joins us for a conversation about cocktails, creating your long-lasting drinking crew, picking the right flavors, the perfect pairings and more!
The below conversation has been edited for length and clarity. Find the full conversation at our YouTube channel.
Joe Winger: Can you tell us a little bit about your story? And what inspired you to create this cocktail smoker kit?
Harel Levy: I’ve been an entrepreneur for the last seven years. While there are no mistakes, I actually found [the cocktail smoker] by mistake. I was planning to buy something for my Dad. I usually won’t give something if it’s not 100%. So I’d rather not give a gift that I don’t really like. Because I really care about what the recipient is going to feel.
“I really love the idea of cocktail smoking kits. […] It’s another tool to have a great night.
I don’t want to give something cheap, because if you really love someone, you really want to make sure that everything is spot on, right?
Even on yourself, you will be more forgiven in terms of what you buy than someone else.
I really love the idea of cocktail smoking kits. It’s not that it’s only cool and it’s a great addition to having those nights with friends, with family. It’s another tool to have a great night.
I went to Amazon and I saw there is no one who actually sells it in a premium, wooden box. And with many flavors. I talked with [my company’s] CEO about it, what’s missing here.
Bark & Barware’s Smoker Kit
We came up with a wooden box. It came from my passion to give something that looks good.
For almost a year, we went back and forth with factories. The smoke. The flavor. Details with the box.
When we released it, we were very happy. We knew my criteria. If I can give it to my Dad, not being afraid he’s not going to like it. Then I know that other people are also going to enjoy it because I have high standards for giving a gift to someone that I love. That’s how we came up with the product and the product.
The second thing we are planning is to bring a mixologist, make it a more holistic experience.
Extend the journey with our customers, give them cocktails, give them recipes, give them ideas, The journey doesn’t end when the transaction happens for us. We want to continue to build trust and serve our customers.
Joe Winger: You have a very comprehensive website. Can you walk us through your Cocktail Smoker Kit? When we buy it what do we get?
Harel Levy: There are six different chip flavors, the culinary torch, the smoke lid. Ice tongs, whiskey stones. Unfortunately, we don’t include butane [gas for the torch] because shipping is very heavily regulated,
“In every smoker kit you get six different chip flavors, the culinary torch, the smoke lid. Ice tongs, whiskey stones.”
We have six flavors: cherry, oak, pear, maple, hickory and apple. Our plan is to listen to our customers and come up with new flavors based on what they ask for. It’s not a one-time product release. We’re going to offer refills, extensions, more.
Each taste is very delicate. The world of wine, flavor, alcohol is so wide and you can get very specific sometimes. When you do get specific, you get the best results, right?
Joe Winger: Has there been one or two major lessons you’ve learned?
Harel Levy: Initially we had more flavors. After we gave out samples and heard about which flavors were the favorite, we removed some.
Joe Winger: You mentioned flavor pairing. What’s your favorite cocktail pairing?
Harel Levy: It’s a tough question because taste is something that is extremely subjective.
We usually put it with scotch. That’s our personal preference. Our customers get very creative with their ideas. That’s why we initially started with those six flavors. But listening to customer feedback, it’s going to grow and change.
Joe Winger: Over a year of research and development, were there any unexpected surprises?
Harel Levy: A lot of people agreed with me on the wooden box. People started asking for smoke refills. They’re going through the smoke faster than I thought. When we launched, I was expecting this to be used for special occasions. But people are using it every week, all the time.
Joe Winger: In the past few weeks, I’ve been in Los Angeles, Brooklyn, New York, Philadelphia. All those places have bars where they’re serving smoked drinks. Now people want to have that experience at home.
Harel Levy: That’s going to make you the hero of the party. You’re the one who brings the cool stuff. I always like to do that.
We really advise [anyone trying this] to taste all of the flavors. Not just one or two. The spectrum of what flavors someone likes or doesn’t like is very wide. You’re probably going to really like 1-2 [of the flavors], and less like the others.
Those 1-2 that you really like, we’re going to offer you refills.
When I host friends [at my house], I drink scotch and it goes well with cherry.
But it’s like a game. You try a lot of things. You find out something that you’re really going to love.
“That’s going to make you the hero of the party. You’re the one who brings the cool stuff.”
Joe Winger: This first kit is a starter kit or a sampler kit. I get those six flavors and I get to decide, “Oh my gosh, I really like this one. Now I need a refill.”
Harel Levy: Exactly. It’s exciting me on a personal level because I’m curious […]. What’s going to make people upgrade a scotch that costs hundreds of dollars?
I can play with the flavor. That will upgrade an experience for the end customer cost hundreds of dollars. I did my part, right? And for them, they’re going to be over the moon. They’re going to be super happy. It’s just going to become one of their routine.
“What’s going to make people upgrade a scotch that costs hundreds of dollars?”
Joe Winger: There are smoking kits all over the place. Dozens of competitors on Amazon. Why should someone choose Bark and Barware?
Harel Levy: It’s the full experience that we offer. It starts with the package. Then the flavors. Most of our competitors offer four, we offer six. We tasted all of the competitors and our flavor is better. Otherwise I would not have released the product.
Our post-purchase [experience] the recipes. We’re working with a mixologist to just create a mini course to go with the kit, go with specific drinks. Customers are going to have access to all of it. How do I mix it? What should I mix it with?
Joe Winger: What does the future of the brand look like?
Harel Levy: We’re planning to release big packages [re-fills] of each flavor. Second thing is the mini courses. We really want to inspire because that’s fun.
The process of drinking with friends, the process of smoking. It’s a fun process. You sit on your balcony, with friends, you open a bottle of wine as well. That’s a fun process.
Our goal is to inspire. Someone [will realize they] like a specific cocktail. We will give them all of the information on how to make it, how to mix it, then we earn a customer for life.
Joe Winger: You mentioned picking a cocktail is like picking a favorite kid. It’s so hard to do. What is your favorite cocktail to use with your smoker?
Harel Levy: Yeah, so that’s a great question. I like the combination of the apple and scotch.
Joe Winger: Because you’re a foodie, are there any specific cocktail and food pairings that you really enjoy with any of your specific flavors?
Harel Levy: My favorite is having an apple flavored scotch with a ribeye. Someone I work with loves the hickory flavor. That’s the beauty of this world, every person has their unique taste.
Shop for Bark and Barware’s Cocktail smoker hit on amazon here: https://amzn.to/3P5c42g
Learn more at: https://www.barkandbarware.com
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Weekend Wine Trip to Colorado: Winemaker Ben Parsons from The Ordinary Fellow reveals wine, food and nature in Palisade CO
Weekend Wine Trip to Colorado: Winemaker Ben Parsons from The Ordinary Fellow reveals wine, food and nature
Ben Parsons, Winemaker and Owner of The Ordinary Fellow in Palisade, Colorado
Today’s conversation has been edited for length and clarity. For the full, un-edited conversation, visit our YouTube channel here.
Joe Winger:
Just to touch on background a little bit, you were the winemaker and founder of a very successful urban winery, the Infinite Monkey Theorem.
Then you chose to move on to where you are now at The Ordinary Fellow.
What was that transition like for you?
Ben Parsons:
The Infinite Monkey Theorem was really about disrupting the wine industry and trying to make wine fun and relevant and accessible.
We were the first ones in the U.S. to put wine in the can. We started kegging in 2008.
It was really about creating these urban winery spaces, just a tap room for a craft brewery in a city where everyone could come down and enjoy.
After 11 years of taking that to a 100,000 case production distributed in 42 states, there was a really good opportunity for me to get back to what I wanted to do, which is being in a vineyard.
Even though that might sound like a cliche, there is something quite romantic about farming and being surrounded by nature and really trying to make the very best wine you can from Colorado fruit that you grow and putting it in a bottle versus buying someone else’s wine and putting it in a can, they’re like two very different things.
I had an opportunity to take over a vineyard in southwest Colorado down in the Four Corners just outside of Cortez, where the Four Corners meet.
It was in disrepair and hadn’t been pruned in four years. So I got back in there and now it’s looking really good.
So that’s taken 4 years. Yeah it’s relatively small. It’s 13 acres of Riesling, Chardonnay, Cabernet Sauvignon.
Sits at 6,000 feet elevation. So very high for a commercial vineyard. And it’s beautiful.
It sits on a national monument called the Yucca House, which is an un-excavated ancestral Pueblan ruin from between the 10th and 12th century.
Starts at Mesa Verde, which most people are familiar with for the ancestral cliff dwellings from the Pueblans down there. It’s just a beautiful location.
Yeah, two very different things, but kind of coming full circle almost as to what I got me into the industry in the beginning, back in the late 90s.
And now back there, but doing it on my own.
Palisade Colorado Winemaker Ben Parsons takes a Vineyard Tour
Joe Winger:
Your famous quote in the wine world: “I miss being in the vineyard”
So for our audience, who’s going to go to wine country this weekend or this summer, when they take a vineyard tour, what should they be looking at?
Ben Parsons:
As to how wine gets from a vineyard and a grape to a bottle. Most people think it just ends up on a grocery store shelf and that is not the case.
It’s really the idea that you could grow something from rootstock, farm it, suffer the vagaries of agricultural production, deal with all of those challenges, do it in a sustainable way.
Ben Parsons, Winemaker and Owner of The Ordinary Fellow in Palisade, Colorado
Determine when you’re going to pick that fruit. Take it into the winery. Ferment it. Turn it into wine. Age it in a barrel. Bottle it. Decide on the branding. Decide on the naming. Come up with a label design.
Take it to all of those small awesome restaurants that everyone wants to hang out at because they’re making great food and getting good press.
You see my wine or I see my wine on someone else’s table, drinking it and to think where that came from.
And how many times those grapes got moved from a to b and then back, from b to c and then c to d whether it be like shoveling grapes with a pitchfork for a destemmer.
Or shoveling fermented grapes into a press with a Home Depot bucket.
Or picking that case up and taking it from here to here, that got handled so many times, so much went into that, that I think there’s a huge disconnect amongst most consumers.
Palisade Colorado Winemaker Ben Parsons on the Area’s Natural Beauty
Joe Winger:
You chose to be in Palisade, Colorado making your wine.
Tell us a little bit about the region and why someone should come visit you in Colorado?
Ben Parsons:
Palisade is beautiful. It’s on the Western slope of Colorado. It’s about a 4 hour drive West of Denver over the mountains.
About 4 1/2 hours East of Salt Lake City.
It’s an American Viticultural Area designate called the Grand Valley and it’s pretty stunning.
You come through this Canyon called the Back Canyon on the North side, you have these book cliff mountains that rise above you on the South side, you have the Colorado River, and it’s a very niche microclimate. It’s definitely an agricultural community.
What a lot of people don’t realize, because they just drive straight past on I-70 is it’s proximity to all things good, outdoorsy.
Within 28 minutes I could be at a local ski resort called Powderhorn. It got 32 feet of snow last year
I’m an hour and a half from Aspen.
I’m an hour and 20 minutes from Moab.
I’m a 10 minute drive from Fruita, which has the best mountain biking in the world.
It’s all old Indian territory. There’s wild mustangs up on the book cliffs.
It’s known for its fruit. It’s actually known for its peaches, believe it or not. Some of the best peaches grown anywhere in the United States. Arguably the best.
But it’s a very small microclimate.
Palisade is around 4,500 feet elevation. There’s about 26 wineries you can tour and visit. Take a few days, spend a weekend.
There’s some good local restaurants, growing their own produce and making real good farm to table food.
Grand Junction is a city that in the last 5 years has really exploded.
And Grand Junction is 10 minutes from Palisade. It went through a series of boom and busts during the oil shale boom business back in the day, but now it’s strongly focused on tourism.
Lots of people are leaving the front range of Denver, Colorado Springs and moving to the Western slope for a kind of quality of life.
Also we have a lot of California transplants because it is cheaper to live. You are outdoors all the time. You can travel long distances very quickly. I put 42,000 miles on my car this year delivering wine all over the state of Colorado.
I feel like the state and this particular area has a lot going for it. Definitely more than enough to fill a long weekend or a week’s trip.
Exploring vineyards, food, farms, outdoor opportunities.
Taking a trip to Moab, it’s really pretty. It’s one of the reasons I moved here.
I’d been in the city for a long time. I grew up just South of London in England, but I lived in London for some time and I loved it when I was young. I love Denver as well.
When I started the Infinite Monkey Theorem, that was really when a lot of people were moving to Denver and it was becoming something substantial.
It was one of the fastest growing cities in the country at that time.
I feel like we were a big part of pushing that growth and in tandem with the other food and beverage scene, like craft breweries and good restaurants.
Joe Winger:
You’ve mentioned different restaurants and food and dinner. Our audience primarily are foodies. We’re in Colorado for a wine weekend, we come to the Ordinary Fellow for a wine tasting.
Can you suggest a few places and different cuisines that are a must visit within 20-30 minutes of you?
Ben Parsons:
In Palisade there’s a good restaurant called Pesh. One of the former line cooks at a linear in Chicago started it with his wife, maybe 5-6 years ago. It’s excellent.
In Grand Junction, where most people stay there’s a few good restaurants started by this guy, Josh Nirenberg, who has been nominated for James Beard award several times for best chef and has one called Bin 707, Then he just opened a third called Jojo’s. He also has a kind of trendy taco spot called Taco Party, which is a fun name.
If you like craft cocktails, there’s a new place that opened called Melrose Spirit Company. Guy opened it in a hotel that was recently renovated. Really cute, really excellent cocktails.
Joe Winger:
Let’s get into the wine geek stuff now and talk about your vineyards. You have Colorado Box Bar, Hawks Nest.
So let’s talk through terroir, soil type, elevation.
Ben Parsons:
So Box Bar, It’s in Cortez, sits around between 6,000 feet elevation.
It’s on this weatheral loam that has some clay in it, which has these water retention properties. It is essentially a desert. So you do have to drip irrigate, there’s less than 7 inches of precipitation a year.
So very little rainfall which is good in some ways in that there is very little disease pressure.
You’re not having to spray. There’s no necessity to spray for powdery mildew or anything down at our vineyards.
It’s essentially farmed very minimalistically.
Lagging very sustainably, which I know people appreciate.
Riesling, Cabernet Sauvignon, Chardonnay. We’re just planting some Chenin Blanc and some Charbonneau, which is an italian red varietal as well.
Hawk’s Nest is not my own property, but I work with a grower called Guy Drew who planted four different kinds of Pinot Noir and two different kinds of Chardonnay there.
That vineyard is at 6, 800 feet and that is the highest commercial vineyard in North America.
Similar soil properties as the Box Bar. Making some really good Pinot Noir.
I think what’s interesting about Colorado is we have a very short growing season, 155 – 165 days. Napa has 240 days. That’s frost free days.
So the thing is that we have such high sunlight exposure because of the elevation and the ultraviolet light that we have the same number of degree days as Napa Valley. So we can ripen like Cabernet Sauvignon, but we’re ripening it in a shorter period of time. That’s fairly unique.
The Ordinary Fellow is really focusing on traditional French varietals from Chenin Blanc Chardonnay, Cabernet Sauvignon, Syrah.
Most recently we took over a vineyard in Utah so I’m actually farming a vineyard about 1 ½ hour drive from Moab called Montezuma Canyon Ranch.
That’s this ancient sandstone with a little bit of clay in there that was planted in 2007. 12 acres of Chenin Blanc, Merlot, Riesling Chardonnay. We made an awesome Utah Rosé vineyard last harvest 2023, which we just released.
You don’t see that many wines from Utah so that’s why I’m excited about it.
I think there’s only 6 wineries in Utah and I’m not sure that many of them get their fruit from Utah.
Joe Winger:
You mentioned that you have one of the highest peak elevation commercial vineyards in North America.
What are the benefits and the disadvantages to such a high elevation?
Ben Parsons:
If you think about spending any time on a mountain, it can be really warm, but as soon as the sun goes down, it gets very cold.
So having high elevation vineyards, even though you might be in a quite a hot growing region as soon as the sun goes down, the temperature does drop.
You have a large diurnal temperature shift.
So in Cortez, in the growth, during the growing season or during ripening, say late September, mid September, late September. We could be 85 to 90 in the day, but 45 to 50 at night, which is a really big temperature swing.
It basically means that the vine has a kind of chance to just shut down and rest.
From an enology perspective, you can retain more natural acidity in the fruit because it’s not being metabolized by having a lot of sunlight constantly and higher temperature. So we don’t have to make any artificial acid additions or anything like that you may have to do in more established wine regions in the United States.
Our wines all have really great balance to them and really good acidity. None of them are overdone. They’re not big, jammy, overly alcoholic.
They’re all well balanced between acids, tannin, alcohol, sugar, but they’re all bone dry.
There is no fermentable sugar in any of them, which leads to palate weight and mouthfeel, but but they’re not sweet per se.
Even my Riesling is bone dry.
Joe Winger:
During the Infinite Monkey Theorem days you led the canned wines movement.
How does it feel seeing it become so incredibly popular and any big lessons you learned from that experience?
Ben Parsons:
I genuinely believe that [we led with canned wines]. In 2009 we entered into a R and D project with Ball Corporation, the largest supply of aluminum cans in the world.
To figure out how to can wine and everyone thought it was stupid and everyone just turned their noses up at it and thought that RTD wine and RTD drinks were stupid.
It’s a tough question because I think that canned wine is good because of its use application, primarily. Where you can take it and where you can drink it.
Now, very rarely do I see people putting the best wine they’ve ever made in a can. So I think it’s all about where you want to drink it, who you want to drink it with. There’s definitely this kind of utility aspect to it.
Also price point wise, you don’t see that many canned wine, four packs above $16,
I would say so. Yeah, price wise, it’s fairly economical from a sustainability perspective. It makes a lot of sense.
But from an absolute quality perspective, you’re probably still going to be buying bottled wine over canned wine.
It’s all about where you’re going to consume it.
Sometimes when I see it I think about when you start any category, there’s always those people that are out there doing it way before anyone else is doing it. It’s those people that usually don’t reap the benefits of it because they put all of the effort into it.
I look at LinkedIn occasionally and I’m just baffled by people that think that it’s a new thing. It just blows my mind.
Joe Winger:
You have an excellent sparkling wine and you’ve mentioned England’s excitement about the sparkling.
Why is England falling in love with sparkling wine? And why should all of us be falling in love with sparkling wine?
Ben Parsons:
Historically, England has consumed a lot of sparkling wine.
But in terms of actually growing grapes and making their own sparkling wine, that’s happened in the last 20 years.
That’s one of those unfortunate advantages of global warming in a kind of isolated geographical area that previously, you wouldn’t have been able to ripen Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, Pinot Meunier.
It would have been a challenge making really good sparkling wine in Kent and Sussex and Southeast England where a lot of it is made.
But with a few degrees temperature rise, that’s now possible. And it’s the same chalk escarpment as champagne. They’re very close to each other.
They’re just separated by 24 miles of the English Channel, right?
So they’re actually geographically very close to each other a little further than 24 miles, but climatically very similar.
So actually, a lot of French champagne houses have bought up land in Kent and Sussex over the last 20 years and have been planting that, and now some of the bubbles are coming out.
Joe Winger:
When I have an opportunity to speak with an Oregon winemaker, we often talk about the challenges based on their region. Do you feel like you are also in a region [Colorado] that’s more problematic?
Can you share a lesson you’ve learned from solving some of those problems?
Ben Parsons:
The whole industry because of the shortness of the growing season, it’s always on a knife edge because you can have late spring frosts that can come through a bud break and just wipe you out.
But you can also have these freak-like early winter freezes in October where there’s there’s still fruit hanging or maybe it’s just come off and it goes from 70 degrees in the day to 8 degrees suddenly, and the sap still flowing in the vines and then all of the vines, the trunks split, the cordon split.
That’s what happened in Palisade maybe 3 or 4 years ago now.
Then in Cortez where Box Bar is, last year we had a hailstorm come through just after the bud break. So our Chardonnay was out and got wiped out. Then the secondary buds pushed and we went from a crop of 36 tons to 10 tons overnight.
That’s just agriculture anywhere. Unfortunately that’s just one of the risks.
Joe Winger:
Let’s talk about wine. Their flavor profiles. The different bottles you offer.
When we come visit your tasting room in Palisade, Colorado any hints about what they should be excited to taste?
Ben Parsons:
Blanc de Noir
Yeah the sparkling wine, that’s Blanc de Noir, so that’s 100% Pinot Noir. That’s about as geeky as it gets, because that’s single vineyard, single grower, single clone of Pinot Noir. only 8 months in barrel. The base wine was barrel aged for about 6 months, and then it was entourage, lying on its utilise in a bottle for six months.
Then it’s put on a riddling rack and hand riddled one bottle at a time. Then disgorged by hand, just take the top off, put your thumb over the top of it so nothing comes out and then no dosage.
So again, just super geeky, like really bone dry, like really crisp, great acid. So that is that wine is super hands on.
It’s delicious. It still gets those more developed, brioche-y notes. Texturally it’s very pleasing on the palate. I think we make really good method champignons, bottle fermented sparkling wine.
Chardonnay
A lot of people these days think it’s trendy to not like chardonnay, because they heard somewhere about that, but there are actually some really good Chardonnays out there, which aren’t all aged in new French oak and haven’t all gone through like a creamy buttery secondary fermentation. And I think mine is one of them. It was aged in 8 year old barrels. So there’s really no influence on it at all.
It’s all hand harvested or whole cluster pressed. I think that wine has a really pretty texture, like this palette coating texture but it has really good acidity and it smells like a ripe peach or a dried apricot. It’s really pretty.
Pinot Noir
Our red pinot noir. Again that spent just 9 months in neutral barrels so I think there was a trend like 20 years ago to put everything in a brand new barrel and every winemakers thought it was cool, but you know in the last 5 – 6 years, I think that has changed
Winemakers are really trying to let the soil and let their vineyards speak for themselves.
Minimal kind of intervention to a certain extent. It is the trend.
Our Pinot Noir has done really well. It’s on the much lighter side. I would say it’s more like a German style Pinot Noir, like lighter with really good acidity, firm tannin. Beautiful aroma.
I think all of our wines are just very well balanced. Very food friendly, very clean. They’re not funky. I’m very proud of that.
Joe Winger:
I’m assuming balance and the clean is a style choice by you?
Ben Parsons:
Balance is easy because it’s done in the vineyard because of the elevation and the retention of acidity. It’s just about when you pick it. So you’re tasting [the grapes] for flavor and like phenolic ripeness and the seeds being brown, et cetera, but you’re also testing a few for your pH, your titratable acidity and your sugar levels. Then you make an informed decision as to when you’re picking it.
The cleanliness part of it really just comes down to the fact that I feel like winemakers, even though this doesn’t sound very romantic, you’re almost just like an insurance manager in that you don’t want to mess it up.
So you make informed decisions, preemptively. You top your barrels, like every 2-3 weeks, you do things to make sure the wine, does not end up flawed through a secondary characteristic developing.
Sometimes that’s a flavor enhancer and sometimes that’s good, but when it’s overdone… I believe there are a lot of wines that they get away with it these days. To me it’s just bad winemaking.
I’m definitely kind of a minimal interventionist
Joe Winger:
I always feel like white wine doesn’t get enough love and respect. People love talking about the complexities of reds. You make a phenomenal Riesling.
Ben Parsons:
Interestingly I really don’t drink red wine anymore. Occasionally I’ll drink some Pinot Noir, but I much prefer drinking white wines. I think a lot of people in the industry crave acidity, and yeah, my reasoning is a good example.
The general consumer in the U. S. still thinks that all raisins are sweet. I think that’s just a common misconception, that’s purely a stylistic choice from the winemaker, and my choice is to allow the yeast to ferment all of the sugar until there is no residual sugar.
To have a wine with high natural acidity that pairs well with food. That’s my choice as a winemaker. Those are the wines that I enjoy most that kind of just leave your palate just like this rasping acidity. Take the enamel off your teeth, and but have beautiful aroma.
Our Riesling is starting to show some characteristics from being in the bottle for 18 months. Where it gets those kind of, it’s tough to say about making it sound bad, but those more kerosene-y , kind of petroleum, kind of eraser like notes, which are very typical of Riesling, intertwined with really nice citrus and green apple.
Yeah, and like really just good structure. That benefits from growing at elevation here for sure.
Joe Winger:
Petit Verdot is probably lesser known, less popular, but it deserves all the love anyway.
Ben Parsons:
Petit Verdot, interesting, like one of the six red Bordeaux grape varieties. Bordeaux is maritime climate. It’s much cooler than Colorado.
It doesn’t really get the chance to ripen as well as it does here. So when it can ripen, it doesn’t just need to get blended into Cabernet Sauvignon or something to just give it more tannin and more structure.
Here it can stand alone as a single varietal.
The greenness is gone. The tannin is not like just rip your face off tannin. It’s well developed. Like silky, velvety, firm, but not like really dry and like Petit Verdot can be. Aromatics are very lifted on it, and it’s not a massive red wine by any means.
That’s grown at a vineyard about half an hour from Box Bar called Canyon of the Ancients and that vineyard was planted in 2006.
Unfortunately we only made about 99 cases of that wine. It’s fun to introduce people to wines that they probably haven’t heard of, but wines that that can stand up to any good red wines that you may have heard of.
Palisade Colorado Winemaker Ben Parsons reveals his Favorite Food
Joe Winger:
Do you identify yourself as a foodie? Can you pick 1-2 of your bottles and your favorite dish for dinner tonight?
Ben Parsons:
Yeah I would definitely pair my Riesling with a Thai curry or even a panang curry. I think it does really well with oriental food that has some level of heat to it. But also I think it does really well with a charcuterie plate, some almonds and some cheese. I think you can’t go wrong with that.
Then my Petit Verdot, for example I think there is more tannin in there. For those of us that like the light grilling you couldn’t go wrong with serving that with a ribeye. It’s delicious. Or if you’re cooking a little heartier food in the winter, maybe a lasagna. Something that can really work with that tannin.
I think my wines do well with a lot of different food just because of the balance that they have, they’re not going to overpower the food and vice versa, which is what it’s all about.
But I also enjoy them, just having a glass on its own, to be honest. When I get home from work, sometimes I love that.
Joe Winger:
I’m watching your Instagram videos quite a bit, and it seems like you’re having a lot of fun sharing knowledge, showing your vineyard, showing what it’s like day to day.
Ben Parsons:
The one time that I do enjoy social media is when you’re in the vineyard or you’re doing something that seems that other people might never have seen before.
I’m in awe of where I am because I feel like it comes across in those videos. It’s pretty down here today, and those are beautiful vineyard sites.
Or if you’re filtering a wine or racking a wine or, trying or shoveling grapes.
Just the imagery comes across and really shows how much work is involved in it. I always struggle when it’s like go take a photo of a bottle of wine in front of a restaurant. I don’t know how you make that look cool.
Find more about Ben Parson’s The Ordinary Fellow website, instagram
More about Palisade, CO
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